WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT
Interview for Museboat Live channel

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06/30/2024 / TEXT CREDITS: WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT, Museboat; PHOTO CREDITS: WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT / Axle Duane Photography Bayview Hotel 23 June 24

The music business is a bit like a poker machine, you put your money in you keep losing and you're just about the to walk away and you get a little reward or payout and that keeps you going, you just keep putting money into the slot machine.

Born into a musical family (father Mick a Jazz pianist and sister Sally a clarinet teacher), Gillespie was first inspired to write songs after hearing Leonard Cohen’s “You Know Who I Am” on a local radio show at the age of 14. Some years later Gillespie made his professional debut busking in Paris subways, playing to audiences in London folk clubs and Sydney’s Darlinghurst cafes before returning to Auckland in the early 80’s. Wayne quickly became one of the leading figures in the prominent Auckland Acoustics movement playing pubs, cafes and folk clubs augmented by his band of brilliant musicians, Denny Stanway (vocals), Brendan Power (Harmonica) and Bob Shepheard (Fretless Bass).

Springing from the Auckland acoustic scene of the early 1980s, Wayne Gillespie released a critically acclaimed self-funded album in New Zealand before crisscrossing the Tasman Sea and eventually relocating to Sydney in 1987 for the Australian release of his second album New Locations (CBS). During his career releasing 6 albums and performing with the likes of Suzanne Vega, Chris Whitley, Stan Ridgeway, Colin Hay and Neil Finn.

His latest project FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT features Wayne Gillespie, Rob Grosser, Nigel Gavin, Ric Robertson, Goby Catt and guests. Original songs by Wayne Gillespie and Rob Grosser inspired by Leonard Cohen, Joni Mitchell, Lou Reed, Neil Young,Tom Waits and Nick Cave on their album FRAZZ was released June 24, 2022. The album FRAZZ concoction of Alt/Folk/Rock/Jazz -with traces of Rock-edge, spiced with cheeky surrealism, Jazz juices, Folk reverence, African flavors, Hypnotic Grooves and Dark Tales.The single METHADONE influenced by Gillespies stint working in a Methadone clinic to fund his musical habit.

Wayne´s music was and is played by many Radio Stations including Museboat Live and is mentioned by many Magazines and Websites worldwide. We are happy to have the privilege to ask him a few questions

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Taunjua: You know that we really love your music on Museboat so we want to know what is behind all of that. Can you explain your music creative process?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

No, I can’t really explain the creative process, looking back I can see how things got made. From the age of 14 I started out with little snippets of words and melodies, going through my head then I got my father who was a Jazz pianist to chart these things out and it would drive him mad and eventually he gave me a guitar. I learned to play it at the age of 17. I started playing the guitar quite late. I would learn one chord and jam on that until I had a melody and some words and try and write something around that. Then I learned two chords and did the same thing, then three chords and finally I got up to four chords. SO that is really the two ways I write. I will be doing something mindless and I get a few lines coming into my head, then I go back and try to create a song or I might be fooling around on the guitar and get an idea in my head and try to get the lyrics and then a melody. I am terrible at writing a song from existing lyrics, I find that very difficult to do. I can work the other way around. Better than a chord patent to come up with a melody.

Taunjua: What song that you have written, have you found the hardest to write?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

Very rarely is a song easy to write, you get a gift. I think of songs just coming really rapidly. I am talking of the Frazz album, the latest one the song that came really easy was the song Chapel Street. Six and half minutes of a story song, based on true events. It was quite easy to write that narrative. The difficult ones for me on Frazz was not so much the chords or the melodies, because a lot of them were built around Rob’s drum rhythms and just came very naturally. The hardest ones are the ones I struggle with lyrically and I keep changing all the time. Bananas#2 is on Frazz. Bananas #1 has different lyrics. We are probably going to do Bananas #3 with slightly different lyrics.

I am struggling with the finished project and I keep trying to polish it up. That was difficult because it was built around a baseline. Delusions was difficult, so I kept changing those lyrics.There is also an early version with different lyrics. Then with the gig last night, I have to remember all the subtle changes from this to this and trying to remember them. She Dances , (Papa Wemba) another one that the lyrics keep changing which is a good thing we are trying to make it more contemporary to reflect the issues or the day or the conflicts of the day.

Taunjua: You described your career as “a series of wins and disappointments with just enough wins to keep me doing it.” What do you consider to be your greatest success in your music career?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

Oh Yes a series of wins and disappointments, I think the music business is a bit like a poker machine, you put your money in you keep losing and you're just about the to walk away and you get a little reward or payout and that keeps you going, you just keep putting money into the slot machine. You get another random payout when you are just about to give up. Great success I think for me, the first album independently was just an acoustic album with some friends of mine I met in the folk club in Auckland. That album got to the finals music awards competing against other albums that had been made by major labels. That was really heady, I had no idea that was going to happen.

Like a bird on the wire, Like a drunk in a midnight choir, I have tried in my way to be free.
Leonard Cohen

In some ways that is a success I am still much proud of, it started off my career. I ended up being signed to a major label for a couple of albums. Which I guess is also a success in some ways. I am a big fan of Susan Vega so getting to support her shows and meet her and to compliment me on my songwriting was a very proud moment. I won the MuseBoat best lyrics award in 2023, I have been retired virtually for 15 to 20 years from the music business and we have been working on this Album Frazz for over 15 years as strange as that sounds. So to get some recognition from Museboat was very encouraging and a wonderful honor for my album when I needed it.

Taunjua: You also completed an honors degree in psychology. Combining your interest in psychology with music you interviewed local musicians for a research project 'The Personality of Rock Musicians'. Can you tell us a bit more about this interesting project?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

Oh, the personalities of rock musicians, well it dawned on me years after making albums and playing original music and playing covers that I wasn’t going to play and making a living at this. I studied Psychology and tried to combine my interests so I did a study on the personalities of rock musicians. That was pretty interesting, what do we know about rock musicians? They are high on the experience which makes sense because it is connected with creativity, ideas, and fantasy. They are generally higher on with eroticism, which is a word I hate to use. But they tend to be higher on anxiety, depression and self consciousness than the average person. I think this is really important for me now that I am counseling people.

Creativity is good for your mental health, but being in the music business is kind of bad for your mental health. That is the summary (Laughs) of the situation. It is great and very healthy to be creative, but the latest studies have shown that being in the music business is bad for your mental health. Yet, that is what we learn and creativity is sometimes low on consciousness because creativity is sometimes breaking the rules and not following someone else’s instructions. That is an important component as well.

Taunjua: You moved to Sydney in 1987 to support the album’s release by CBS Australia and played live extensively around Australia and made several guest TV appearances including a memorable appearance on the Don Lane show with Robert Downey Jnr or shows with Suzanne Vega at the Auckland Town Hall on her 1988 NZ tour. Tell us what is the difference between the music scene in New Zealand and Australia? Is there any at all?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

I still have a piece of paper signed by Robert Downey Jr..” Wayne you are already in my Top 40”. signed by Robert Downey, Jr. I have that piece of paper somewhere. The question about the difference between New Zealand and Australia, I guess is like the difference between Canada and the USA or maybe England and Holland or Finland and Sweden. New Zealand is smaller and is more community based, when I was coming through very few people were making a living out of making music. It was a very strong, supportive environment that went across the genres. I came from the folk scene and when I had some success, supporting the equivalent of the Rolling Stones, the big named rock bands. They would be going out supporting them, and were really embraced by those people. It just shows the supportive nature of all the stars you get in New Zealand.

Like a bird on the wire, Like a drunk in a midnight choir, I have tried in my way to be free
Joni Mitchell “Boho Dance"

People make music because it means something to them rather than trying to come up with a commercial product. When I moved to Australia it was quite a different world, a big commercial world. Very difficult to do stuff on your own, independently without a manager, a booking agent and a record label. It was a different world completely, I was used to doing things on my own and I got quite a shock when I came to Australia, because you couldn’t do it there. They had an established music industry and it was controlled by a few of the big players. Pop rock was big here and we were used to entertaining noisy, drunken crowds. Where in New Zealand there were more cafes and concert halls, well known musical bands came up and played concert halls they never played pubs. so it was quite a bit different.

Taunjua: We are a radio station supporting independent artists to get their music heard. Do you have any valuable advice to up and coming artists to get their music to the world? What works and what doesn´t when it comes to music production and where do you see the music industry in the upcoming years? No idea - uncertain future AI difficulty selling product streaming issues, etc.

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

In terms of advice for Indie artists, well for me it's kind of trial and error. I think it is amazing with these online radio stations and Museboat being really amazing and supporting Indie artists. It is something to try and get your music to music stations like Museboat for me. That was like getting a publicist and the radio helps kind of send it around. It made a massive difference, I think you have to budget in having other people send your music out. What works and doesn’t work when it comes to music production. It is whatever works, because there are so many different ways of doing it. I am very old school, we started recording Frazz on tape then converted the tape to pro tool so that is what creates the warm sound, instead of an 8-track and being added to it.

Books where artists in noble poverty, go like virgins to the grave.
Albert Camus

I don’t really have any tips for production, it is whatever works for you. Rob Grosser has his own studio and it certainly helps with having the ability and equipment to make your own music. I am terrible technology wise so building a team around whether it offends you or not is really important in the terms of producing music. Where do I see the music industry in the upcoming years? I have no idea, it is such and uncertain time, streaming, Spotify, not playing people under 1000 streams for each song, it is really uncertain, AI what is that going to do? I am hopeful that vinyl is still around.

Taunjua: What is the funniest story behind your work?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

The funniest story, there are quite a few but one I was reminded of recently was, I was playing with a harmonica player Brendon Power when I was in England (he is actually on 1 track in Frazz). We were playing a little cafe in Auckland around ‘85. In walked a couple of guys and one of them asked if they could sit in. Playing original music I am a bit weary with people coming in and not knowing my stuff and wanting to sit in and play them. I said, no, someone tapped me on the shoulder and said, Do you know who that is? Bob Marley was in town and that was Carlton Barret the drummer and his brother Aston the family man that walked into the cafe and wanted to sit in and play and I had told them they couldn’t play. So I quickly raced after them and said, no man that is fine you can play. I had written a Reggae song when I was in England, so I got to play a Reggae song with Carlton on percussion. Unfortunately he was killed a couple years after that. That part is not funny, but it was a funny story at the time. They also promised us free tickets but Bob Marly passed away in Miami. We got out names on the door and got to hang out with the band.

Taunjua: I probably know the answer but still… If it were possible, who would you most like to share the music stage with and why?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

Who would I like to share the stage with, yeah you probably do know the answer Leonard Cohen and the name of the band the famous Blue Raincoats or not. The inspiration of hearing his music when I was 14, it literally changed my life. I knew I wasn’t going to be the Beatles but I was in love with music. To hear Leonard and his deep voice. which I had and he couldn't sing that well and he wasn’t Eric Clapton on guitar, but it seemed achievable. He melded music with poetry. which I was kind of writing poems about daffodils and dew drops when I was a kid. It really spoke to me and I would have loved to play support for him and believe me I tried. I even got to talk to his manager in LA once. That would have been pretty special but unfortunately he is no longer around.

Taunjua: OK, this one is from Andy. Your song Methadone literally pushed me back in my chair, Wayne. The harmony of the musical text and the music was absolutely unique for me. Where did you get the inspiration for this song?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

Oh thanks Andy, yeah. Methadone… I mean the lyrical idea came from… I did a stint working in a Methadone clinic. I knew Methadone was long acting and Heroin was short acting. I was mucking around on the guitar and the words just popped into my head and I built a song around that. It was shaped by Rob Grosser’s production, that is one I took to him the completed version. He added the congos, the drums and the choruses, the waz on the guitar and the fix. We had a sax and a harmonica on it. We decided not to use a bass on it, which kind of creates that space with the acoustic. It came out utterly unique and a summary of what we were trying to do, amalgamate rock and jazz in one style. Methadone kind of encapsulates that. I am very proud of that recording.

Taunjua: What are your plans for the future? Especially the short-term ones?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

Plans for the future, short term one, well yeah I guess, short term seems to be the most relevant, not planning too many years ahead. At the moment I just started working on a follow up to that acoustic album that I was talking about. I started off with it and got recognition in New Zealand, that one was called Wayward Son. Exactly 40 years later, I am starting to work on a Wayward Father Album, which is more about maturity. Hopefully we will finish it before I become Wayward grandfather. I am producing for my original producer, Trevor Lucas who used to be in a band called Fabel Convention. His wife Sandy Denny and he have a granddaughter, Jamira Jade who lives in Sydney and she is very talented and I am producing some demos for her as well. That is two short term projects. I plan to keep playing live, that keeps things real and communicating with the audience.

Taunjua: Is there anything you would like to say to Museboat listeners?

WAYNE GILLESPIE & FAMOUS BLUE RAINCOAT:

A massive thanks to the Museboat listeners and the other musicians as well for supporting these amazing Indie artists who struggle so much to get their music heard. Museboat is such a station with heart and a sense of community with the listeners and artists as well from all over the world. It is really amazing. We meet in the chatroom and create this community around Indie artists and to hear some of the amazing music that is on Museboat as well. A big thanks for Methadone being my calling card into that community, and for playing it even when I was not responding to your messages. (Laughs) Probably a couple of months before I came into the chat room to check it out. Big thanks to people that come into Museboat and are into Indie music. It means so much to us artist to have people and stations like that to support us.

This interview was brought to you by
Taunjua aka TJ
host to the TJ´s Muse Bridge show